Quick Question

"Wobbles the Mind" (wobblesthemind)
01/27/2016 at 17:39 • Filed to: Mustang Ecoboost

Do you think Ford will continue with the 4-cylinder Mustang when they refresh it? I thought it was odd to begin with but soon we will have a Focus that makes more power with the same engine, and a Fusion with a more interesting engine than two thirds of the Mustang’s available options. Seems like offering the 2.7L, 3.5L, and 5.0L would be a logical route, but whatever.

DISCUSSION (21)

DasWauto > Wobbles the Mind
01/27/2016 at 17:46

Yes, the NA V6 will die for the 4 pot turbo. While I’d love to see it used, the 3.5 EB is a tougher question. I don’t think Ford want to supplant the V8 in the Mustang. Not now, if ever, because that’s the main thing to cling to for muscle cars and they’d alienate too much of their fanbase in doing so. The 2.7 EB might provide a middle ground between the (then) base turbo and the V8 though.

Saracen > Wobbles the Mind
01/27/2016 at 17:48

But the Focus that makes more power costs ten grand more than the equivalent Mustang. Entirely apples to oranges.

And how much will that fusion cost? Probably close to $40k.

For damn sure, I don’t see a justifiable case for a 2.7 EB, 3.5EB, GT and GT350.

lone_liberal > Wobbles the Mind
01/27/2016 at 17:52

I do. They want the turbo 4 to be the sales leader in Europe, though the 2.7 turbo six makes more sense to me. They need a low cost engine for rental car duty so a NA V6 makes sense there.

Wobbles the Mind > DasWauto
01/27/2016 at 17:52

I was actually thinking the base car would be the 325hp 2.7L and the midtrim would be the 365hp (or 380hp) 3.5L. The GT would keep with the 435hp 5.0L. No 4-cylinder at all since the Fiesta, Focus, Fusion, Escape, and Edge all use it I think.

Wobbles the Mind > Saracen
01/27/2016 at 17:57

I thought the Ecoboost manual started at $30k with destination? I was under the impression that everyone and their mother said the current V6 Stang is just a rental/marketing special and the “real” base Mustang is the 4-cyl.

duurtlang > lone_liberal
01/27/2016 at 18:02

I really don’t think Europe is a factor. Sales numbers in Europe are tiny by comparison anyway. I’ve seen one (1) current gen Mustang. If they really want to sell Mustangs in Europe they’d need a diesel, as it’ll have much more sales potential than the Ecoboost or the V8. I’m not even joking here.

DasWauto > Wobbles the Mind
01/27/2016 at 18:04

I’d see the current Boostang as the base model (maybe bumped to ~320hp), the 2.7 (or maybe a 3.0) at ~370hp or so and the V8 at ~450hp to match the Camaro SS.

Gone > Wobbles the Mind
01/27/2016 at 18:07

I could see the V6 dying in the next iteration, but prob not at refresh. Rental fleets will just have to deal with buying the EB4. Having 3 powertrains for a relatively niche vehicle is cost prohibitive (same with the Camaro). Perhaps they’ll have two tunes - a low/hi power EB4. I think the V8 dies at the end of Gen7 (next gen), but it might die after Gen6. Keeping it around will be tough because MPG requirements, but maybe it stays in the high end (GT350 models) Gen6 only.
They better do something at refresh regarding weight, power, and overall performance. The 2016 SS absolutely trounces the GT in every aspect - power, weight, performance except cost. And trunk space if that’s your thing.

Saracen > Wobbles the Mind
01/27/2016 at 18:09

Yeah, the V6 is a rental special and starts at $24k. The 2.3EB is $26,500 after destination.

PS9 > Wobbles the Mind
01/27/2016 at 18:12

Short answer: Yes.

Long answer: The 4 cylinder isn’t there to be a stop gap until they find a better V6; It’s meant to replace the option entirely. The next refresh won’t have an NA V6 option at all, and you might have to think about a top of the line Shelby if you want a V8 when the next model changeover comes.

lone_liberal > duurtlang
01/27/2016 at 18:13

I think that was what the plan was, though from what I’ve read what Mustangs they do sell in Europe are almost all V8 powered . The future of diesel is kind of up in the air, isn’t it? Even without the whole VW thing a lot of people have been pushing to end the regulatory environment that favored diesel for air quality reasons. Like I said, if it were me I’d go NA V6 for rental, 2.7l turbo six in the middle and various flavors of V8 on top.

Leon711 > Wobbles the Mind
01/27/2016 at 18:25

Everyone is wrong. The 4cyl exists for the Yurrupeen market, if it ceases to be offered in the US, it’ll continue here.

it’s been offered officially in the UK for the first time and I’ve only ever seen one in the flesh in about a year.

Wobbles the Mind > Leon711
01/27/2016 at 18:28

I thought they were going to make a Diestang for you guys. Some turbo 1.5L diesel with 112hp and 346.3lb-ft at 30rpm or however that works over there.

Leon711 > Wobbles the Mind
01/27/2016 at 18:36

it might do them good for compay car sales a nice 3l diesel pushing near 300 hp with a boat load of torque, Top Gear Magazine did a comparo with a 2l Audi TT, they preferred the TT. http://www.topgear.com/car-news/usa/t…

duurtlang > lone_liberal
01/27/2016 at 18:39

Well, it’s really quite an easy comparison. I’m assuming the 2.0L bi-turbo diesel from the Mondeo with a slightly higher amount of torque than the Boostang, but at 2000 rpm less. Guestimated real world fuel economy:

diesel: 7L/100 km. 1L = €0.90. 30k a year. Yearly fuel bill: €1890
gasoline: 10L/100 km. 1L = €1.25. 30k km a year. Yearly fuel bill: €3750

Even today, with low fuel prices, a diesel is attractive to many. Especially to those who drive a lot. Whatever the future might bring is moot, see all those in the US flocking towards huge SUVs as if fuel prices will never rise again. That doesn’t stop manufacturers from offering more SUVs.

BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind > Wobbles the Mind
01/27/2016 at 18:53

I have no opinions here other than “whoa, Ford makes a lot of different (and good) engines...”

Wobbles the Mind > BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind
01/27/2016 at 19:07

Yeah, I don’t think people realize the amount of variety in engines we have now because they only look at how many times they appear in different models, or they only break them apart by displacement. Have you looked at the amount of different AMG engines there are now? I had to check if they place plaques on all of them and last I checked, yes they do! So GLA45 AMG to S65 AMG

ranwhenparked > Wobbles the Mind
01/27/2016 at 20:33

Yes, Ford has put a lot of money and effort into establishing the EcoBoost 4 as the mainstream Mustang (including derating and decontenting the V6 model to make it as unattractive as possible), and it is absolutely going to continue for the foreseeable future. The only question will be how long the V6 sticks around.

Wobbles the Mind > ranwhenparked
01/27/2016 at 21:21

My view is that Ford merely used the Mustang to sell the idea of all Ecoboost 4-cyls as performance engines, that way there would be no questioning performance when placed in Fiesta, Focus, Escape, Edge, etc. Just like the F-150 sold the Ecoboost 6-cyls as being work capable in big trucks and SUVs. Now they are doing it again with the new GT to push the 3.5L as well as the new Raptor. I think Ford is the only brand using models to sell engines rather than engines to sell models. Hell, look how we always say ecoboost even though a majority of turbo engines on the market are “ecoboosts.” The engines dont even have port-injection yet! It would be a missed opportunity to not have the Ford GT engine in the Mustang and the Ecoboost 4-cyls have the RS and STs for leverage now. The 2.7L V6 however doesn’t have anything propping it up as a premium engine or a true performance engine right now.

PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power > Wobbles the Mind
01/27/2016 at 23:08

the Boostang will stay around. it’s a great seller, and a great platform. the V6 will be going down soon though.

as for the Coyote? I’m looking at buying a Coyote Stang right now, so I hope that's around for a bit longer

marshknute > Wobbles the Mind
01/28/2016 at 07:44

I suspect the new Raptor is a test subject to see how customers react to a V6 replacing a V8.

If the Raptor does well, I honestly wouldn't be surprised to see the Mustang GT go EcoBoost V6, and leave the V8 for the Shelby variants.